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kingofnerf

The Breonna Taylor incident and the 2nd Amendment

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Are you talking about whether he had a right to defend himself from cops, or he had a right to do what he did when he didn't know they were cops?

Disallowing no-knock warrants, especially for circumstances as dubious as this would be a good thing.  You want a no knock raid on a drug cartel processing facility and you have evidence to back it up?  Go to town.

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As I have said in other threads, I would have probably gotten killed as well, (atf would have killed all my dogs in tbe process). 

No knock warrants should be reserved for  known violent criminals that would be likley to fight or as KOB mentioned big raids on drug manufacturing/importing locations. 

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9 minutes ago, TKE226 said:

It appears the cops will not be charged. 

I am not disagreeing with the ruling - believe it or not, I realize that the police have a tough job and most are not bad - but this could get ugly.

The bad things keep happening and nothing is being done about it. We have a total lack of response from the federal level other than r=inflammatory rhetoric about squelching protests (to improve Trump's position with his base). And the local/state authorities keep letting this stuff happen without repercussions or preventive measures put in place.

Say what you want about Biden, but he would say something to ease the hostility and take steps to improve the situation. Trump will do nothing other than promise stormtroopers to shut down the protests that will follow. And, unfortunately, they will get violent - peoples' voices are being totally ignored, at all levels.

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On 9/15/2020 at 12:18 PM, kingofnerf said:

Did the young man who allegedly triggered (pun intended) the shooting by firing at the cops first, because he thought they were robbers, have a Constitutional right to bear arms to protect himself?

Seems the constitution is clear. It also seems that police have been given the legal means to sidestep the constitution. 

Unfortunately, if this was replayed in most households, the outcome would be the same. 

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On 9/15/2020 at 3:18 PM, kingofnerf said:

Did the young man who allegedly triggered (pun intended) the shooting by firing at the cops first, because he thought they were robbers, have a Constitutional right to bear arms to protect himself?

Of course he had the right to both own and use his personal weapon to defend himself against people...anyone...blasting the door off its hinges and breaking into the private residence he and his girlfriend were asleep in.  

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3 minutes ago, LBC said:

Of course he had the right to both own and use his personal weapon to defend himself against people...anyone...blasting the door off its hinges and breaking into the private residence he and his girlfriend were asleep in.  

One of the reasons behind body cams is to clarify situations like this - so it is not a "he said, she said thing". Well, more like a "police said, victim said" - because she is not able to say anything.

Horribly mis-managed all the way - but in fairness to the cops that were cleared, a lot of the errors were made prior to the raid - approving the no-knock warrant, going ahead with the raid after they apprehended the guy they were actually going after, not knowing that Taylor broke up with the drug-dealing boyfriend months earlier, etc.

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On 9/15/2020 at 3:57 PM, carolina_corpsman said:

As I have said in other threads, I would have probably gotten killed as well, (atf would have killed all my dogs in tbe process). 

No knock warrants should be reserved for  known violent criminals that would be likley to fight or as KOB mentioned big raids on drug manufacturing/importing locations. 

I'm pretty sure I would have been shot and killed as well...you blast my door off the hinges in the middle of the night and I'm pointing a weapon at you...sorry

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1 hour ago, JimG said:

Seems the constitution is clear. It also seems that police have been given the legal means to sidestep the constitution. 

Unfortunately, if this was replayed in most households, the outcome would be the same. 

I agree.

Quote

Walker told investigators when he heard banging at the door his first thought was that it was Taylor's ex-boyfriend. He was concerned there might be trouble, so he grabbed his gun.

Although it wasn't her ex-boyfriend at the door, this potential situation that Walker was in can happen and is why the Second Amendment is there.

Quote

Police believed Taylor was home alone when she was in fact accompanied by her boyfriend, who was legally armed, according to a CNN review of the shooting. That miscalculation, along with the decision to press forward with a high-risk, forced-entry raid under questionable circumstances, contributed to the deadly outcome.

Taylor's ex-boyfriend was the actual focus of a narcotics investigation that led officers to execute the warrant on her apartment, where no drugs were found.

Police said a man was shipping drugs to Taylor's apartment to avoid detection of a trafficking ring, according to a police affidavit for a search warrant, which was obtained by CNN.  The search warrant authorized police to search Taylor's apartment, two vehicles, and three people, including Taylor, and to seize, among other things, drugs and drug paraphernalia, money, safes, weapons, documents and computers. The warrant did not specifically connect Taylor to any alleged drug activity, and Taylor's family and their attorney have maintained that she was not involved in her ex-boyfriend's alleged drug trade.

Taylor was sleeping next to her boyfriend, Kenneth Walker III, in the early hours of March 13, and when they heard a noise they both got up and walked to the door.  "She's yelling at the top of her lungs — and I am too at this point — 'who is it?' " recalled Walker, her boyfriend. "No answer. No response. No anything."

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/23/us/breonna-taylor-attorney-general-grand-jury-announcement/index.html

As soon as the cops heard a male voice inside, that changed everything, because they weren't expecting anyone else to be there.  The other voice could have been a mule for her ex-boyfriend for all they knew.

My perception is no-knock warrants are there to protect LEOs by not giving the bad guys time to get to their weapons.  I don't follow this story as much as others do, but I remember a few weeks ago hearing that Walker fired first through a closed door and the officers then returned fire through the same closed door blindly without seeing who they were shooting at and that's why so many bullets hit Breonna.

What stands out to me is that Walker had to carry a weapon to protect himself or both of them from her ex-boyfriend.  To me, that makes me think her ex-boyfriend could either have been stalking her or sending drugs to her apartment against her will to the point that LEOs witnessed him going over there enough under surveillance before the shooting took place to justify the search warrant.

If that was actually the case, it still doesn't justify the way she died and that's why the LMPD paid her estate $12M.

I also remember the attempted murder charge against Walker was "dismissed with prejudice", which means he can be re-charged again if needed.

Others here probably know more than me about the details, but this is just my unemotional view of it.

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5 minutes ago, kingofnerf said:

I agree.

Although it wasn't her ex-boyfriend at the door, this potential situation that Walker was in can happen and is why the Second Amendment is there.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/23/us/breonna-taylor-attorney-general-grand-jury-announcement/index.html

As soon as the cops heard a male voice inside, that changed everything, because they weren't expecting anyone else to be there.  The other voice could have been a mule for her ex-boyfriend for all they knew.

My perception is no-knock warrants are there to protect LEOs by not giving the bad guys time to get to their weapons.  I don't follow this story as much as others do, but I remember a few weeks ago hearing that Walker fired first through a closed door and the officers then returned fire through the same closed door blindly without seeing who they were shooting at and that's why so many bullets hit Breonna.

What stands out to me is that Walker had to carry a weapon to protect himself or both of them from her ex-boyfriend.  To me, that makes me think her ex-boyfriend could either have been stalking her or sending drugs to her apartment against her will to the point that LEOs witnessed him going over there enough under surveillance before the shooting took place to justify the search warrant.

If that was actually the case, it still doesn't justify the way she died and that's why the LMPD paid her estate $12M.

I also remember the attempted murder charge against Walker was "dismissed with prejudice", which means he can be re-charged again if needed.

Others here probably know more than me about the details, but this is just my unemotional view of it.

The Louisville postal inspectors responsible for relaying information about drugs being shipped have no reclamation or documentation for what the police are claiming. 

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1 hour ago, kingofnerf said:

I agree.

Although it wasn't her ex-boyfriend at the door, this potential situation that Walker was in can happen and is why the Second Amendment is there.

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/23/us/breonna-taylor-attorney-general-grand-jury-announcement/index.html

As soon as the cops heard a male voice inside, that changed everything, because they weren't expecting anyone else to be there.  The other voice could have been a mule for her ex-boyfriend for all they knew.

My perception is no-knock warrants are there to protect LEOs by not giving the bad guys time to get to their weapons.  I don't follow this story as much as others do, but I remember a few weeks ago hearing that Walker fired first through a closed door and the officers then returned fire through the same closed door blindly without seeing who they were shooting at and that's why so many bullets hit Breonna.

What stands out to me is that Walker had to carry a weapon to protect himself or both of them from her ex-boyfriend.  To me, that makes me think her ex-boyfriend could either have been stalking her or sending drugs to her apartment against her will to the point that LEOs witnessed him going over there enough under surveillance before the shooting took place to justify the search warrant.

If that was actually the case, it still doesn't justify the way she died and that's why the LMPD paid her estate $12M.

I also remember the attempted murder charge against Walker was "dismissed with prejudice", which means he can be re-charged again if needed.

Others here probably know more than me about the details, but this is just my unemotional view of it.

Why would an American citizen in legal possession of a legal firearm mean they were probably being stalked or having drugs shipped to their home against their will? 

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25 minutes ago, LBC said:

Why would an American citizen in legal possession of a legal firearm mean they were probably being staked or having drugs shipped to their home against their will? 

Walker said he pulled his weapon because he thought her ex-BF might be at the door.

I didn't say that, Walker did.  Why don't you ask him. 

It's odd that a large civil settlement was paid before a trial even happened.  That's a lot of money.  To me that says LMPD is admitting they botched the investigation.

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16 minutes ago, gamecock88 said:

If I had time to get my weapon after someone kicked in my door, I'm not waiting to see who they're employed by. 

I get that, but the police chief said this was not a no knock warrant. Witnesses said the police had announced themselves prior to entering. 

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42 minutes ago, taylorssc said:

You’d point a weapon at police officers?

YES! Anyone knocks the door to my private property off the hinges in the middle of the night while me and mine are asleep in my bed...every fucking time. 

I'm sure you'd be making coffee and giving hand jobs but I still have a shred of actual free American left in me. I've done my part. I've served this country. I don't take a backseat to some civil servant. My wife and kids can enjoy the multi-million dollar settlement but I've got responsibilities as a father, husband, man and American. I've not already turned over like you have. Don't worry...I'll defend you too...again.

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1 hour ago, LBC said:

I think one thing is clear here...it needs to be way harder to become a police officer in this country and way easier to be a black women asleep in her own bed...how racist does someone need to be to defend any aspect of this shit?

Why don't you ask that white devil, KY AG Daniel Cameron, who decided not to press the charges.

XnNKsTYi_400x400.jpg

The cops on the streets in these incidents are white, but the individuals in leadership positions are African-American in these problematic cities.

Don't their lives and careers matter as much as those of the common criminals in many of these police brutality cases?

They are in their positions because Jim Crow segregation is gone and integration works.

Daniel Cameron is a very intelligent African-American AG.  Doesn't his life matter as well?

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9 minutes ago, taylorssc said:

I get that, but the police chief said this was not a no knock warrant. Witnesses said the police had announced themselves prior to entering. 

Police said a lot of things didn't they.  The question was would I point my gun at them.  If my door is breached I'm not waiting to hear an announcement.  Speaking only for what I would try to do and not judging anyone in this case. I admittedly know very little of the facts.

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8 minutes ago, gamecock88 said:

Police said a lot of things didn't they.  The question was would I point my gun at them.  If my door is breached I'm not waiting to hear an announcement.  Speaking only for what I would try to do and not judging anyone in this case. I admittedly know very little of the facts.

I would think a rational person would just answer the door. 

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